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We are still finishing the fight against cancer on the boards. Each time it beats us identically – with a metastasis. What if you left the corner with the Trojan horse? Professor Magda Król from the Faculty of Veterinary Medicine of the Warsaw University of Life Sciences is going to do it. He already knows how to get the drug to places where chemotherapy cannot reach – deep into the tumor. She was given one million four hundred thousand euros to complete her idea. This is a grant from the European Research Council.
Zuzanna Opolska, Medonet: Professor, how many hours does a day have?
Prof. Magdalena Król, SGGW: Not enough! 24 …
I am asking because you are 35 years old and the number of scientific successes is sensational. Scientific internships abroad, scholarship of the Ministry of Science and Higher Education for outstanding young scientists, Young Investigator Scholarship in Veterinary Medicine, scholarship in the L’Oréal Poland program for Women and Science, POLITYKA Scientific Award 2013, won in the poll “Poles with verve” in the Science category and now prestigious European Research Council grant. I wonder how it’s done …
I really can’t answer that question. When I hear or see this list, I don’t believe it’s about me. The key is that I love my job and I am very happy with what I do. And I have such a character that if I love something, I give myself to it fully. Everything, of course, takes place at the expense of free time, which I practically do not have. After work, I rush to kindergarten to get my daughter, spend a few hours with her, and then work until one in the morning at the computer. Without the support and help of loved ones, all this would be physically impossible. A day is only 24 hours long, but proper organization of work and planning saves time. I create simple daily to-do lists that I complete step by step. I start with the most important things, and do the rest whenever possible.
We will talk about the European Research Council Grant. Was the competition deadly?
Three thousand talented people applied, I do not know how many grants were awarded in total, because the ERC has not published the statistics yet. The rule is a dozen or so candidates for one place. Everyone measures strength for intentions, applying beyond a great idea must demonstrate scientific maturity, previous achievements and relevant publications. If the project is poorly written or weak in terms of content, and the candidate does not meet certain requirements, he may be banned from starting in the next edition. On the other hand, I think that many Poles are completely unnecessarily afraid to apply because of the competition’s reputation. We are not worse than our western neighbors, we only have less courage. For the second stage – an interview in Brussels, the best of the best, roughly three people, are invited to one place.
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What does an interview look like?
The whole process takes about 25 minutes. It starts with the presentation of the project, a description of the planned research and implementation plan, and ends with an interview with the members of the commission. I was invited to the second stage in mid-March and I had three months to polish my presentation. At that time, my project went to external reviewers, and when I was going to Brussels, I did not know the results of their opinions. I had to find the weakest points of the grant myself and possibly get ahead of the allegations of the committee members. I got eight reviews in total, that’s an awful lot …
The more opinions the better?
The more opinions, the more balanced the decision. In Polish grants, these are usually two reviews. The ones I got were similar to each other, all super positive. The ERC motto consists of “high risk, high gain” projects, i.e. high risk but groundbreaking projects if they are successful, mine was rated “high risk, extremely high gain” and was selected to promote the competition on the ERC website. After the interview, I was pleased with myself, but I did not expect such success. My laptop got stuck during the presentation. I knew I only had ten minutes and the projector would shut down in a moment. My legs were like cotton wool, the most important day, the most important hour, and the slide does not want to move for anything in the world. Fortunately, after a while it worked.
This is the moment when the heart stops …
Indescribable stress. The committee members were very fair and gave me an extra half minute.
How many people does the committee consist of?
About twenty and everyone has the right to ask a question. The warehouse is secret. One of the panellists is the project maintainer who knows all the reviews. I learned from Poles sitting on other panels that a ranking list is created on the basis of external reviews and that the panellists look at candidates through this prism. There was a very nice atmosphere during the conversation, I had the impression that the committee was very interested in the topic. However, I had no idea how my competition went, sometimes with an equal level of candidates, the nuances decide about winning. It’s like hundredths of a second at the finish line in an F1 race. All these thoughts kept bothering me for the next two months. I received a letter of congratulations from the ERC chairman before the official announcement of the results.
Husband found out first?
We were on vacation when the mail came from Brussels. That first e-mail was so intricately written that I had to read it five times to understand whether I got a grant or not. Immediately after it, however, came an e-mail from the European Commission asking for press materials because my grant, as one of the highest rated, was selected by the ERC for promotion.
What is the awarded project about?
The idea is simple, but sometimes the simplest solutions are the best. I think the committee liked the obvious and uncomplicated nature of the project. I found that immune cells pass on proteins to cancer cells whose function seems to be well known, although the function is only known in a single cell. It is not known what the function of these proteins is when they are passed between cells, or for what purpose immune cells pass them on to cancer cells. A so far unknown mechanism can tell us a lot about the new function of cells in the immune system. Additionally, these proteins have a cage structure. Perhaps we will be able to use them and pack various types of drugs into them. The aim of my project is to use the physiological mechanisms: the migration of immune cells to the hypoxic and ischemic areas within the tumor, where no drugs reach, and the transfer of protein cages to cancer cells. After chemotherapy, the tumor seems to have disappeared because most of its mass has been removed. However, cancer cells remain in these inaccessible areas and cause recurrence or metastasis
Will the team composition change for the purposes of the project?
Yes, I have to recruit new employees, so the team will grow. I have a doctor – post-doc, three doctoral students and a technician. Plus various experts who will be engaged for specific tasks.
Everyone from Poland?
I do not know yet, an international competition will be announced on the ERC website. For me, nationality does not matter, I want to choose the best. It would certainly be a good idea to bring someone from abroad to the university, even a Polish academic emigrant. Poland does not have such long traditions in life sciences as Great Britain and it rarely happens that a great scientist from abroad comes to Poland. Grant ERC is a good carrot to change that. It is worth emphasizing that I could implement the grant anywhere in the world. Oxford will welcome each scholarship holder with open arms. There are even ERC grant hunters, i.e. research units that recruit scholarship holders by offering them very favorable conditions.
And yet you decided to stay, why?
I feel good at my University, there are laboratories that allow me to implement a project on a world-class level. The project will also be implemented in cooperation with the Medical University of Warsaw and the University of Warsaw, and I have clear paths everywhere. Besides, I also have other obligations that keep me at home.
However, it was the trips abroad that were groundbreaking in your life. I am thinking of a scholarship in Amsterdam …
The Netherlands gave me a new perspective on science. Different work atmosphere, people and methods. During my postdoctoral internship in Amsterdam, I met Professor Jeffrey Pollard from New York. I was very interested in the topic of “corruption” by cancer cells of macrophages. Later, thanks to the Foundation for Polish Science, I went to his laboratory and became my mentor. In addition to inventiveness and scientific reliability, experience and cooperation are the most important, which is why I send PhD students abroad. I encourage them to go to conferences, workshops and trainings. Without joining forces and cooperation, my project and ERC grant would not exist. Italian chemists, a group from the Medical University of Warsaw and employees of the University of Warsaw helped. Our brainstorming sessions together lasted not two hours, but usually four or five hours.
Do you conduct research on a canine model?
Not any more. During my doctorate, I was involved in the study of mammary tumors in bitches, then I did my habilitation in the cancer microenvironment in dogs, and now I changed the scope of my interests. Of course, in the future, dogs may also be a recipient of this method, but ultimately it is human. I do preclinical research in an in vitro laboratory, i.e. at the level of cells in test tubes, and in vivo in mice.
But it is dogs, not rodents, that are more like humans …
Yes, it is. In the first stage of research, however, I have to refine the method on simpler models to use it on more complex ones. If I use one strain of mice for research, each strain is the same and I am able to carry out the experiment many times in repeatable conditions. If I get the same result in 95% of the cases, I am sure about the results. We have different breeds of dogs, different types of tumor, and finding a narrow, repeatable group is very difficult. It’s a great model for drug metabolism, far superior to rodents. Especially if I was testing a new drug with an unknown effect. During the project, however, I will use drugs already available on the market, only the method of their delivery to the tumor will be completely different.
You chose veterinary medicine because of your love for animals …
Yes, I have loved animals since I was a child. I had an amateur kennel of bouvier des Flandres, where many international champions were born. I took part in exhibitions many times, I even wrote a book about dogs of this breed. Of course, I studied in Warsaw, and my parents in Płock dealt with breeding on a daily basis. Shortly after graduation, I worked in a clinic. But it is a very hard piece of bread, especially in Warsaw, where we have an animal clinic at every turn. Sometimes I would come home at three in the morning, and I would take night shifts a few times a week. In addition, I had to reconcile all this with a doctorate and translation of veterinary textbooks to earn a living. With time, my heart for the profession of veterinarian was less and less and I chose to study. I do not regret this decision. Until recently, I kept saying that if I win the lottery, I would set up my own animal clinic. Today I don’t have such dreams anymore.
Dog breeding is gone?
No, I couldn’t find time for that. One nine-year-old beloved shag who lives with his parents is left. I browse websites with sentiment, check top kennels, look at photos of current champions. Recently, my five-year-old daughter Agatka suggests that we need a new tenant. Each drawing is me or her with a dog on a leash. On the one hand, I know that my responsibilities will fall on me and my husband, and on the other hand, it is difficult for a child to refuse.
Anyone in your family involved in veterinary medicine?
No, dad writes books and mom is the chief accountant. My grandmother was a microbiologist, she ran a medical analysis laboratory, and her father, Edmund Giedroyć, studied medicine. After his father’s death, however, he had to quit his studies and start working to support his siblings. Grandpa was a chemist and director of a distillery. So I probably inherited biological and chemical genes and genes from this part of the family.
Only child?
Tak.
Dad is Jack Sharp? Jacek Ostrowski?
My dad is Jacek Ostrowski, who sometimes hides under various pseudonyms, for example, he published the book “A man with a tattoo” as Jack Sharp.
I read an interview in which he mentioned that he wrote a lot in a drawer …
He wrote the first book when I was born. The publisher did not like her and he stopped writing for many years. Personally, I liked his debut very much, science fiction, ahead of its time. I think our conversations prompted him to rewrite. Until today, he has published a lot of books. We have a light pen in our family, and the family tree shows that we are distant relatives of Adam Mickiewicz.
Are you the first reviewer?
I read, my family reads, and then the book is published by a publishing house. We discuss the plot and the hero, everyone has some comments, but in the end it is always the creator who decides. Dad has infinite processing capacity, the premiere of the new book “The Last Visit”, a novel based on the facts about the abduction of Dr. Kamińska from Płock, is scheduled for the beginning of the new year, and is about to end the next.
He also wrote “Transplantation” – a sensational novel about finding a heart donor, needed the help of experts?
Yes, he asked me and my husband Karol, who is a cardiologist.
Where did you meet?
While studying in a ballroom dance course. A friend of mine met us, who had no marital intentions. During the conversation, she only mentioned that she had signed up for a course organized by the Medical Academy and that her friend needed a partner.
It surprised immediately?
Tak.
Is it difficult to separate private and professional life?
Very much, research often takes place at non-standard hours. I am available for employees around the clock. I don’t leave them alone in the lab. My PhD students always know that they can call at any time and I will pick up the phone. I also had such support in my boss, prof. Tomasz Motyl and I know it’s very important.
What do you like to do in your spare time?
Unfortunately, I have hardly any free time. Of course, I try to devote most of it to Agatka. I read books, go to the gym, skip TV and ride a bike, mainly in the work-home direction and back.
Reliable plans for the future?
So many unpredictable things are happening in my life and so fast that I have a hard time making plans. What is relevant today is not valid tomorrow. Everyone has dreams of course, for example I would like to run a small hotel in Italy one day.
Prof. Magda Król – specialist in experimental oncology and associate professor at the Faculty of Veterinary Medicine at the Warsaw University of Life Sciences. Winner of the scientific award of the Polityka weekly (2013) and winner of the “Poles with verve” plebiscite in the science category (2014). She received, among others Ministry of Science and Higher Education scholarship for outstanding young scientists, Pfizer Animal Health scholarship, L’Oreal postdoctoral scholarship and the Unesco award for women. In 2016, the European Research Council (ERC) awarded her the prestigious Starting Grant worth EUR 1,4 million. He is a member of several scientific societies, incl. American Association of Cancer Research, European Association of Cancer Research.
Photo: Tadeusz Późniak, «Politics»